Crazy Pat Robertson...
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miftah
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Crazy Pat Robertson...
He's at it again. That crazy Pat Robertson. He's getting so stupid, he's almost becoming inadvertantly amusing.
"Fear of the bee means the honey is for me" - Jhonn Balance
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eddiecanuck
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I guess the worst part of this is that Pat Robertson actually leads people. It would be okay if this was just his stupid perception and that's as far as it went, but he has a large following. I'd have to say, if my pastor ever came up with this idiotic scenario, I'd get up and walk out and never look back. I guess that's why I keep going to the church I do, our pastor preaches compassion and loving your fellow man above all else.
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miftah
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I used to be sort of fatalistic about it... "Well, if they're stupid enough to follow those assholes, they deserve where they get led to." That was when the assholes were just asking for money.
But now there's quite a few of them and they all want power. Political power. In fact the whole initiative on the part of the Religious Right's push into politics is very troubling. And it kills me how the pose is one of victimization. These religious leaders know damn well they're not being victimized. They know all too damn well what they're talking about it the beginnings of a theocracy, or at least a partial one.
Combine that with the philosophical stance that true Christians should know nothing of compromise, and you have the makings of a very unhappy conflict.
Makes you wonder what the prophet himself would make of all of this.
But now there's quite a few of them and they all want power. Political power. In fact the whole initiative on the part of the Religious Right's push into politics is very troubling. And it kills me how the pose is one of victimization. These religious leaders know damn well they're not being victimized. They know all too damn well what they're talking about it the beginnings of a theocracy, or at least a partial one.
Combine that with the philosophical stance that true Christians should know nothing of compromise, and you have the makings of a very unhappy conflict.
Makes you wonder what the prophet himself would make of all of this.
"Fear of the bee means the honey is for me" - Jhonn Balance
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Rocketdork
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what I don't get is why he cares.
Who cares is Ellen is lesbian? Who cares if anybody is homosexual.
There are only two reasons that I can come up with as to why a christian would care that somebody is gay...
1. The christian's salvation depends on whether or not Ellen "turns away from evil".
2. They want to have sex with Ellen, and now they can't cause she doesn't like men.
To point one, the way I understand it is that every bodies salvation is dependent on Christ's sacrifice on the cross. Nobody can take away your salvation by their actions...only you can. Unless I am mistaken, even Christ can't take it away if you play by the rules. So what happened to the concept of "love the sinner, hate the sin". Since from a christian point of view, none are free from sin...none have room to point and say "sinner". Why is it that some sin is enough to prevent the sinner from entering into the fold and other sin isn't enough. Case in point. Many churches BAR homosexuals from even worshipping, but the same church will minister to the murders on death row. Can someone explain how Christ would condone that behaviour?
To point two, why does Pat Roberson want to have sex with Ellen? He is a married man, right? Ellen isn't a catch anyway, let the women have her.
These are the only to salient points that I can come up with as to why Pat would care if Ellen is gay. The only other way that I can understand this is that Pat ACTUALY believes this shit. I would hate Ellen too if she caused the trajedy that happened on Sept 11, or the huricane that killed and hurt so many in the south. Can he really believe this shit? Then he is more fucked up that I give him credit for.
In the end I guess I am with Miftah on this, I used to be fatalistic about it, but now it pisses me off. I lump shit heads like pat in the same group of extremeists that Osama bin Laden belongs to...there really isn't any difference in my mind. This shit head is as big a threat to my freedom as the other.
What would the prophet himself think? I'll bet he is sitting in his golden chariot wondering where his church went....
Who cares is Ellen is lesbian? Who cares if anybody is homosexual.
There are only two reasons that I can come up with as to why a christian would care that somebody is gay...
1. The christian's salvation depends on whether or not Ellen "turns away from evil".
2. They want to have sex with Ellen, and now they can't cause she doesn't like men.
To point one, the way I understand it is that every bodies salvation is dependent on Christ's sacrifice on the cross. Nobody can take away your salvation by their actions...only you can. Unless I am mistaken, even Christ can't take it away if you play by the rules. So what happened to the concept of "love the sinner, hate the sin". Since from a christian point of view, none are free from sin...none have room to point and say "sinner". Why is it that some sin is enough to prevent the sinner from entering into the fold and other sin isn't enough. Case in point. Many churches BAR homosexuals from even worshipping, but the same church will minister to the murders on death row. Can someone explain how Christ would condone that behaviour?
To point two, why does Pat Roberson want to have sex with Ellen? He is a married man, right? Ellen isn't a catch anyway, let the women have her.
These are the only to salient points that I can come up with as to why Pat would care if Ellen is gay. The only other way that I can understand this is that Pat ACTUALY believes this shit. I would hate Ellen too if she caused the trajedy that happened on Sept 11, or the huricane that killed and hurt so many in the south. Can he really believe this shit? Then he is more fucked up that I give him credit for.
In the end I guess I am with Miftah on this, I used to be fatalistic about it, but now it pisses me off. I lump shit heads like pat in the same group of extremeists that Osama bin Laden belongs to...there really isn't any difference in my mind. This shit head is as big a threat to my freedom as the other.
What would the prophet himself think? I'll bet he is sitting in his golden chariot wondering where his church went....
"A man without a woman is like a statue without pigeons"
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eddiecanuck
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Hmm, don't know that I see how you get to point number 2
But yeah, I pretty much am with you on point number 1. If you accept Christ as your savior and that he died on the cross for your sin, then you shall be redeemed. From there (at least in our church) you are taught to begin to learn and know Christ which then follows that you would lead your life in a certain way. Does it mean you will never commit a sin? No. Does it mean if you commit a sin your out? No. I think that is where a lot of churches loose people is in this hard stance of we don't want sinners in our church. Well isn't it more important to get people who are further away from Christ into church instead of pushing them away? Again I'm not one to cast stones so to speak as I sin on a regular basis, but if the goal is to help people, the last thing you want to do is ban them from showing up in the first place. If Pat really wanted to "help" Ellen, wouldn't he try reaching out to her instead of writing her off and saying ban her?
Oh, and don't get me started on the Tony awards
But yeah, I pretty much am with you on point number 1. If you accept Christ as your savior and that he died on the cross for your sin, then you shall be redeemed. From there (at least in our church) you are taught to begin to learn and know Christ which then follows that you would lead your life in a certain way. Does it mean you will never commit a sin? No. Does it mean if you commit a sin your out? No. I think that is where a lot of churches loose people is in this hard stance of we don't want sinners in our church. Well isn't it more important to get people who are further away from Christ into church instead of pushing them away? Again I'm not one to cast stones so to speak as I sin on a regular basis, but if the goal is to help people, the last thing you want to do is ban them from showing up in the first place. If Pat really wanted to "help" Ellen, wouldn't he try reaching out to her instead of writing her off and saying ban her?
Oh, and don't get me started on the Tony awards
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Rocketdork
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I guess point two comes from the realization that it could be one reason why a person would object to another being gay. I mean, what does anothers sexuality really mean to someone else? The only time we (should) care about a persons sexuality is when we want to have sex with them. If they are gay, that takes them out the pool of potential partners, right? If you wanted to have sex with that person, and now you can't because you found out they were gay, well, it would matter to you.
Since I am in a committed monogomas relationship, the only persons sexuality *I* care about is my partners. Outside of that? It doesn't effect me in any way.
In the end, if a persons sexuality doesn't have any effect on me what-so-ever, why object to it?
I guess that's the point I was trying to make, Ellen being a lesbian doesn't have any effect what-so-ever on Pat, so why does he feel the need to speak out about it?
Since I am in a committed monogomas relationship, the only persons sexuality *I* care about is my partners. Outside of that? It doesn't effect me in any way.
In the end, if a persons sexuality doesn't have any effect on me what-so-ever, why object to it?
I guess that's the point I was trying to make, Ellen being a lesbian doesn't have any effect what-so-ever on Pat, so why does he feel the need to speak out about it?
"A man without a woman is like a statue without pigeons"
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eddiecanuck
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eddiecanuck
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