bowling for columbine...

Post by **eddiecanuck** » Tue Sep 23, 2003 2:29 pm

"um, guns are bad m'kay? people who use guns are bad, m'kay? so don't use guns, cause if you use guns your bad, m'kay?"

Sorry, not to belittle the conversation, I just love Mr. Mackey's logic and thought I'd throw it in for levity.
Please continue

AsaJay · Post by **AsaJay** » Tue Sep 23, 2003 3:12 pm

This is how our own department of Justice has collected and presented information. Lots of reading, scary.

AsaJay · Post by **AsaJay** » Tue Sep 23, 2003 3:20 pm

eddiecanuck wrote:"um, guns are bad m'kay? people who use guns are bad, m'kay? so don't use guns, cause if you use guns your bad, m'kay?"

Reading as I look at the avatar, I started laughing to myself

. Levity is necessary in all things.

Post by **miftah** » Tue Sep 23, 2003 4:38 pm

AsaJay wrote:In both instances of child-shooting incidents cited in the film, it's my impression that nothing was done or said about any other conditions leading up to the shooting. It's sensationalism. Kid walks in, shoots peers, kills self, game over. What made them do it? That's the question I want answered. Was it just because guns were readily available? Was it because they played violent video games? Was it because they had parents who didn't know what their kids were doing? Was it . . . ?

Um, AsaJay, you really need to see this movie. If you had seen it, you would know that the basis for the movie was EXACTLY what you're asking for. He went looking for answers. That's the plot of the movie.

He never blames the NRA. He merely asks why they would in good consciousness, decide to hold rallys so soon after incidents of school shootings. Even if they didn't intend to exploit the shootings, it would have been decent if they had postponed. And they didn't.

Fuck... Manson cancelled his shows in Denver at the time, and Chuck Heston is too insensitive to do the same? Moses is the moral lesser to the AntiChrist Superstar?

My issue with the NRA is not that they support rights to owning guns. If I could afford one and were a little less manic depressive, I'd own one. My issue with the NRA is that every time we try to make a law preventing the misuse and abuse of weapons, the NRA gets in the way. They are single-minded and unbending. In that, they serve to disrupt any progress we may make in the interest of improving our country.

Post by **miftah** » Tue Sep 23, 2003 4:41 pm

And by the way, consumerism (or more specifically the advertising industry) is responsible for the shootings. I'd go into more details, but when I have it together, I'll post my artist's manifesto here on this site.

AsaJay · Post by **AsaJay** » Tue Sep 23, 2003 5:10 pm

miftah wrote:Um, AsaJay, you really need to see this movie.

Agreed.

miftah wrote:He never blames the NRA. He merely asks why they would in good consciousness, decide to hold rallys so soon after incidents of school shootings. Even if they didn't intend to exploit the shootings, it would have been decent if they had postponed. And they didn't.

Two weeks after Columbine, and the NRA for the most part cancelled everything except corporate business. They stayed low-key, they understoond the sensitivity. But you may be right, maybe they should have cancelled the corporate meeting as well. You'd think it could have been re-scheduled for somewhere else at another time. But I think the mis-reprentation in Moore's film (note: I've still not seen it), is his implication that the NRA held a "rally", and he used footage from another rally held prior to Columbine to drive home his point. I remember the whole incident back when it happened. I remember the NRA cancelling all rally activities. Though I was a bit surprised they still were holding the corporate activity, I thought it was the best they could do to cancel all the highly visible stuff. And later, there wasn't much being reported in the papers either.

As for Flint, again the implication in the movie (as I understand it, and have not seen it), is that the NRA held a rally right after the shootings. In today's age, I had no idea that eight months later was considered "right after". Again, I think this is bending the truth a little bit to tug on emotions.

I would think it darn insensitive of the NRA to go and hold a rally within a few months of a tragedy like that. But eight months later? I think that was sufficient time to digest the events, form conclusions, get back to normal life and go on. I'm sure there are a lot of responsible gun owners in Flint that were happy to have the rally when it did finally arrive. What was the mood in Flint at the time? What was the published public reaction in the local papers when it came? Did the locals think it was too soon? (maybe they did, I've not seen the movie, so I'm asking)

Again, Miftah makes the table round.

AsaJay · Post by **AsaJay** » Tue Sep 23, 2003 5:14 pm

miftah wrote:And by the way, consumerism (or more specifically the advertising industry) is responsible for the shootings. I'd go into more details, but when I have it together, I'll post my artist's manifesto here on this site.

Man, I'll hold the nail and you swing the hammer.

That is the kind of thing I --really-- want to see, that is, if you are adding the general "media" to that industry/consumerism. Therein lies much of the truth I think many fail to see. I'm interested to read what you write.

Rocketdork · Post by **Rocketdork** » Wed Sep 24, 2003 9:04 am

miftah wrote:Fuck... Manson cancelled his shows in Denver at the time, and Chuck Heston is too insensitive to do the same? Moses is the moral lesser to the AntiChrist Superstar?

hehe, had to giggle when I read this line...I like Manson!

Saw an interview with him on MTV one day...putting asside the shock statements (in my opinion he uses the makeup, statements and persona to attract attention, and thereby bring the all mighty dollar to his hand) he was one of the most well spoken and intelligent rock stars I have ever had the pleasure to hear. About two days later, heard and interview with Duncan Sheik, I host single celled animals that are brighter than this guy. Not the sharpest fork in the knife drawer.